Admin Complaint

[Love-To-Hug]

Admin Key: Elysian_Prince, Necaladun, Spacemanspark, SkyPing

Your Discord name (if applicable): Love-To-Hug#6238

Complaint: A full retelling of what transpired as discussed between myself and Elysian_Prince can be found here: https://pastebin.com/jhRX08WD

Here is the "short version".

I was jobbanned from all heads of staff for a week and science for 3 days for interfering in the arrest of someone I felt was innocent. I have no idea if they were or not, but I had confidence in my worker.

I was playing Research Director. I was heading back to Science when I witnessed Skakreshss Shesikor getting cuffed by Beepsky. Believing this to be a mistake, I uncuffed him and figured it was just an antag running around with a sec hud. The HoS shows up and orders for his arrest of him and some other civi I didn't really care much about. I was naturally protective of someone in my department and I demanded charges.

The HoS, Vah'ris, said his fingerprints were found on empty freedom implant and adrenal implant cases. Skakreshss Shesikor said he merely saw the empty cases in R&D and threw them away, and given that he didn't use them to evade arrest, I felt it was insufficient evidence and I began calling for the Captain. This is when the HoS began to escalate the situation.It seemed to me the HoS wanted to open this guy up on the surgery table to check for implants. So this was beyond a standard arrest in my opinion, this was opening up someone's chest over fingerprints when there was context that suggested they didn't have the implants at all.*

*Supposedly (and I learned this after the fact in talks with Elysian_Prince) an upgraded body scanner can check for implants. But in all my days of playing on Paradise I've never seen a scientist zap one of those with a bluespace RPED, so I had no idea that was even a solution. But then, who can say if the HoS knew this, either. He sure didn't say one way or the other. 

Despite that my worker was not running but rather trying to peacefully cooperate, the HoS immediately drew his baton, stunned him, and recuffed him. This, again, is silly because if he had the implants in the first place, it wouldn't have mattered if this action was performed. In my mind, it was excessive force. I kept calling for the Captain, but the Captain did not come. The HoS had apparently ordered more Security to show up to take the suspects away and began dragging them off. I kept demanding he stop and wait for the Captain. When it became clear he would't, I instead pulled the scientist away and took him back to the department and uncuffed him.

Again, I went to extraordinary lengths to try to get the captain's attention, I even went to my office and did a station announcement for him to come to R&D. Then I noticed that security was trying to raid my department. I tried to keep them out, but was unsuccessful. They got in through a maintenance tunnel. I soon realized they weren't just going after the scientist anymore, they were now coming after me. I was hit with something, I don't know what, and my armor teleported me into the nearby maintenance tunnel.

The HoS had x-ray vision (not authorized by me) and began to give chase. I immediately started to head toward the bridge. It was at this point the HoS began to fire his gun at me on LETHAL. (Keep in mind this was still on green alert). He ran out of shots and then pulled out a baton. I disarmed him and then I began using the baton on him - doing 0 damage, merely stunning him while I dragged him to the bridge. The moment I arrived I started telling the Captain that the HoS just organized a raid on my department, and the Captain was not pleased with the HoS trying to go over his head. He got cuffed, but by the blueshield, not me.

At this point I assumed the situation was over. It was proven that the cult (which I didn't even know existed until after the incident) was in cargo and not science. I resumed to business as usual.

Much to my surprise I was bwoinked, and it was explained that not only had my actions earned me a jobban, but there were admins that wanted me to be fully banned entirely - before even speaking with me, mind you, as Elysian_Prince explained.

While I'm glad Elysian_Prince took a measured approach, I find punishing anyone at all for this completely in-character situation to be absurd. This is a grey area in the first place, and when you consider our rules have exceptions for breaking people out of jail - trying to protect someone you feel is innocent from arrest being handled with bans is very strange to me.

Here are the ban notes for my job ban as written by Elysian_Prince.

Quote

Infringement on, rules: 5 and 7.

Long-standing player with many, many notes. Rules being cited are: Self-antagging, actively diverting security away, not upholding the higher standard of roleplay and competance. More were put up for discussion, however, these were the conclusions among several admins.

I take strong issue with Rule 5 being cited here. I had every tech shipped back to central command, I was actively distributing power tools to engineers, mining was fully equipped, the station was fully upgraded (by me), and earlier in the shift I had even delivered lockboxed weapons for them to stash away - while delivering surgical tools to the brig bay.

I feel completely justified in my actions and that this would be considered 'poor roleplay' when I was trying to defend an innocent upsets me.

I do not feel I broke Rule 7 for the reasons I cited above. The only force I ever exercised was trying to impede security from raiding my department while trying to get the Captain's attention, and then using the telebaton's stun (no damage) to take the HoS to the bridge once he started firing lethals at me.

Edited March 31, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[Spacemanspark]

Wait, what did I do?

[Love-To-Hug]

10 minutes ago, Spacemanspark said:

Wait, what did I do?

I listed all the admins that were online at the time, as I was told by Elysian_Prince it was a joint decision from the admins that were online. If you had no involvement in this discussion I'll remove you from the post.

Edited March 31, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[Spacemanspark]

Leave me in, then.

[Love-To-Hug]

I have an important addendum, I really shouldn't have left this out. I'll edit this into the OP for new readers.

It seemed to me the HoS wanted to open this guy up on the surgery table to check for implants. So this was beyond a standard arrest in my opinion, this was opening up someone's chest over fingerprints when there was context that suggested they didn't have the implants at all.

Supposedly (and I learned this way after the fact) an upgraded body scanner can check for implants. But in all my days of playing on Paradise I've never seen a scientist zap one of those with a bluespace RPED, so I had no idea that was even a solution. But then, who can say if the HoS knew this, either. He sure didn't say one way or the other.

Edited March 31, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[necaladun]

First of all - if you believe someone is innocent, you should still not be interfering in the arrest. It is not your job as the RD, and you wouldn't have access to the intelligence that the HoS has. In such a situation, the HoS is under no obligation to share that with you, either - especially as you are a suspect yourself (And were also in possession of contraband). Your feelings towards innocence do not override evidence.

While I understand why you might want to prevent unnecessary surgery, your lack of competence and knowledge in regards to bodyscanners does not excuse that. In this case,

The HoS was well within their rights to arrest someone when they found their fingerprints on a case. Fingerprints on contraband is clearly evidence of possession. Stuncuffing is quite standard, especially with potentially dangerous and armed people - in this case they were also a suspected cultist. A suspected EoC, who they have evidence of having implants that may prevent easy capture, should be stunned and cuffed ASAP. If they then break out of the cuffs due to the implants, then that confirms it.

The HoS is under no obligation to wait for the captain. Security is their department, not yours. You thus committed a crime when you pulled them away from the HoS. The correct way of disputing this is through IAA, NT Reps, Magistrates, and the Captain. Not by assisting them in resisting arrest.

You keeping security out of the department is also clearly interfering in an arrest, to the extent of breaking the rules - it required security to go to heavy lengths to have to catch you (who had committed a crime already, not including the major crimes and possible EoC status of your implants). Blockading the entrances to RD is quite over the top, too.

Thus security was well within their rights to detain you, having committed crimes. Assisting a fugitive makes you also guilty here.

As you were unable to be captured, due to your implants and reactive armour, lethal force was allowable. This could have easily been avoided by you surrendering instead of resisting arrest. With no other option to detain you, without your surrender, lethal force is in fact the only viable option.

The HoS in no way went over the Captain's head. Arrests and security are the HoS's department. Unless the Captain ordered him to do otherwise - such as to deal with cargo instead - he was not just in his rights, but obliged, to deal with the crimes of science. Given the evidence he had, he would be negligent to not arrest those he believed involved. The Captain's permission is not required to arrest people, especially when someone is committing a crime right in front of them.

 

The fact you do not see the problems here is quite worrying, as does that you feel you were completely justified in your actions. Were it not for the fact it would discourage admin complaints in the future, I would in fact see this as grounds to extend the ban.

 

You didn't once mention your own implants here, which I frankly find to be dishonest and highly relevant. This is not how a head should be acting. You should have been quite concerned with the reports of illegal implants, and been assisting security in finding the culprits - not been committing crimes yourself. The RD should be stopping people from getting illegal implants, not getting them themselves. As a reminder: "Having 2 or more of these, or using any one of these items to commit a crime, automatically classifies you as an Enemy of the Corporation.". I'm not saying you have to be 100% loyal to NT and by the book, but at the very least you should attempt to co-operate with them when people are suspected of being EoC, and not free them from capture.

 

Thus, I see no merit to this complaint at all, and in fact Ely was quite merciful - and was the only admin to speak in your defence, and even took an hour of his time to try to explain it to you, which was not required. The others suspected you would not understand the problems and argued for a heavier ban. All admins I've spoken to (At least 6), have agreed that this is without merit - although in less kind terms.

 

This would have been better suited for an appeal, disagreeing with the decision, rather than an admin complaint, as no admin misconduct took place. I see this as an attempt to stir up drama. We're getting VERY sick of that.

[Love-To-Hug]

31 minutes ago, necaladun said:

First of all - if you believe someone is innocent, you should still not be interfering in the arrest. It is not your job as the RD, and you wouldn't have access to the intelligence that the HoS has. In such a situation, the HoS is under no obligation to share that with you, either - especially as you are a suspect yourself (And were also in possession of contraband). Your feelings towards innocence do not override evidence.

You make a lot of points in your post, but it really doesn't address the core issue: Why is preventing an arrest treated so radically different from trying to break someone out of the brig, which is allowed?

 

31 minutes ago, necaladun said:

While I understand why you might want to prevent unnecessary surgery, your lack of competence and knowledge in regards to bodyscanners does not excuse that. In this case,

Lack of competence over not knowing about upgraded body scanners? It's not detailed on the wiki, I've never seen them upgraded, how was I to realistically learn this? Up until recently, everyone thought there was only ever two door power wires. There's a lot of little things people don't know and being clear about one's intentions would've saved a lot of headache.

 

31 minutes ago, necaladun said:

Thus, I see no merit to this complaint at all, and in fact Ely was quite merciful - and was the only admin to speak in your defence, and even took an hour of his time to try to explain it to you, which was not required. The others suspected you would not understand the problems and argued for a heavier ban. All admins I've spoken to (At least 6), have agreed that this is without merit - although in less kind terms.

Most of the time we spent was simply explaining what happened as you can see from the log. I am thankful for the effort, because the way the situation sounded is that I would've been banned for this otherwise.

 

31 minutes ago, necaladun said:

This would have been better suited for an appeal, disagreeing with the decision, rather than an admin complaint, as no admin misconduct took place. I see this as an attempt to stir up drama. We're getting VERY sick of that.

Perhaps I'm missing something, how does doing this as a complaint rather than an appeal generate any more or less drama? I felt it was better suited as a complaint because appeals are usually more suited to asking forgiveness.

Edited March 31, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[Love-To-Hug]

1 hour ago, necaladun said:

You didn't once mention your own implants here, which I frankly find to be dishonest and highly relevant. This is not how a head should be acting. You should have been quite concerned with the reports of illegal implants, and been assisting security in finding the culprits - not been committing crimes yourself. The RD should be stopping people from getting illegal implants, not getting them themselves. As a reminder: "Having 2 or more of these, or using any one of these items to commit a crime, automatically classifies you as an Enemy of the Corporation.". I'm not saying you have to be 100% loyal to NT and by the book, but at the very least you should attempt to co-operate with them when people are suspected of being EoC, and not free them from capture.

Honestly, I was hoping not to get into this, because it is its own big can of worms. Fact of the matter is, this is common behavior for the department and not because of me. Before I even learned to do R&D, scientists and RDs were making adrenaline and freedom implants every round. It is remarkably easy to do and it does not require any illegal tech from maintenance whatsoever to get going. Not even a suspicious toolbox. It was actually another non-antag RD that even taught me how to get it so easily. I forget the name.

Does that mean it's right? Of course not. In that respect I can relent on some wrongdoing. But the reality of the situation is... trying to be the sort of RD that prevents people from playing with their toys makes you hated by your employees. I know because I used to do it. And it sucks. I wish it wasn't possible to make the damn things (or just much harder to) so this moral ambiguity wasn't a part of the job. Damned if I do, damned if I don't.

What made me change my mind about policing the implants is it didn't seem to be anything rulebreaking. I've been told by admins in the past that for the most part, SOP is only really enforced at the administrative level for Security. But it seems to be very subjective, just depends on who you ask... and who the person in question is. As you pointed out, I'm not seen favorably these days.

Edited March 31, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[Kyet]

Bluntly:

• Everything Neca said is accurate.
• Other peoples' behavior does not excuse yours.
• There is a time and a place for suggesting rules changes. An admin complaint thread, made soon after you've received a job ban for breaking the rules, is not it.
• This would be much less of an issue if you were simply able to admit you were wrong, and learn from it. Instead, you seem determined to fight, and cause unnecessary arguments.
• Given your behavior history, and how you are on such thin ice at this point, you are extremely lucky to have come out of that incident with only a week long job ban. All you have accomplished in this complaint is alienate the only online admin who was prepared to speak up in your defense.
• I advise you to admit you were wrong, learn from it, and be a lot less willing to point the finger at others in future.

Edited March 31, 2017 by tzo

[Love-To-Hug]

12 minutes ago, tzo said:

There is a time and a place for questioning why a rule is a certain way. An admin complaint thread, made soon after you've received a job ban for breaking the rules, is not it.

I stand by that I did not break any rules.

I'm not questioning why a rule is a certain way. I'm questioning why something similar that isn't handled by the rules is treated so differently.

Edited March 31, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[SkyPing]

As the Head of Security that shift, I will be providing my side of the story purely from the IC perspective.  I kept my contributions to the discussion the round after minimal due to conflict of interest.  I was also deadmined during this particular round.

Before the actual incident, the xray implants were provided to us by the RD in a locker.  LTH dragged the locker over to the brigbay themselves and placed me on a bed to perform surgery, which I declined because a Geneticist stabbed me with an xray gene modification earlier in the shift (Legal under Geneticist SoP section 3).

That shift, I was messaged by a civilian that he found 2 empty Adrenal and an empty Freedom implant cases in disposals maint.  I snatch them up and give them to the detective, who state that the fingerprints belonged to two Unathi that I can't recall the names of.  At the same time, Propane, a Plasmaman Officer, reports seeing cult runes off station, confirming that they're real.  Putting two and two together, I call for the Captain that we have cultists and to set us to red, and then set the two Unathi's to arrest in order to check them for implants.  This was the high priority of the day due to the contraband charges attached to both the Adrenal and Freedom implants.

Beepsky quickly captured both of them outside of the Science Hallway.  I head over there and ask for another officer to assist me so we can bring both of them to medbay to check for the implants.  LTH, the RD, is also outside the hallway with a Sechud, setting them off arrest.  They seemed to be under the impression that someone was randomly setting people to arrest with their own sechuds.  I explain that thats not the case and that they were both suspected to have used illegal implants due to their fingerprints being on the cases.  They and the captured Unathi argue that they were just cleaning up the implants, but I insisted on checking them anyways due to them possessing the only fingerprints on the cases, and there was still the potential of them to use the implants.  LTH uncuffed one of the Unathi in the process, citing how they could have used the freedom implant at any time to escape.  I recuff them due to the fact that there was only one freedom implant found in disposals, thus providing the possibility that one of them could have not had a freedom implant to begin with.

After a few minutes of circular arguing, two officers and a sec borg come over and aid me in dragging the two to medbay.  Once we get to medbay, LTH grabs one of the Unathi that I was dragging and uses her Adrenal implant to run back to science.  I order one of the officers to stay with the remaining Unathi, and then me and the two other security personnel rushed over to science.  Once we tried to get in, she set up a wall blocking us from entering, so we circle through toxins maint.

At this point, the other Unathi is nowhere to be seen, but LTH is, and since they've been aiding and abetting plus owned their own adrenal implant, we decided to go after the criminal we could see.  We managed to stun them a couple times in RnD, but failed to put handcuffs on due to the Adrenal implant.  They eventually get teleported into science maint due to the reactive teleporter armor.

Seeing as we tried and failed to capture her non-lethally, I order for Lethal force to be used and chase after her into the chapel.  I get too close, she stunbatons me and drags me to the bridge, where for some reason the BS cuffs me to the chair and the Captain, who still left the alert at green despite the confirmed cultists, berated me despite the fact.

I decide to just drop the incident, ignoring the protests of the other security officers, simply because I quickly figured that anything and everything would completely go over this Captains head.  The BS uncuffed me after I explained the situation, we decide to ultimately ignore the RD due to them not being worth the time, and we spend the rest of the round focusing on the Cult invasion in Cargo.

[Love-To-Hug]

That seems accurate to me. My story does not conflict with yours in any way. I had my own perspective and you had yours. I couldn't act off knowledge I didn't have and I did what I felt was right.

Why this has to be handled at the administrative level is something I don't understand. It's why I didn't make a player complaint. This was an in-character issue and, in my opinion, should've stayed an in-character issue.

Edited March 31, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[FreeStylaLT]

After having read through everyone's statements, I would like to ask @Love-To-Hug:

What were you seeking as the final goal when you decided to actively take away a cuffed suspect from Security right in front of their faces, while using an adrenal implant during said chase? After that, what was your thought process and final goal while barricading yourself away from them? What was the end result you were seeking, both ICly and OOCly, when you kept avoiding stuns in that situation?

[Love-To-Hug]

3 hours ago, FreeStylaLT said:

After having read through everyone's statements, I would like to ask @Love-To-Hug:

What were you seeking as the final goal when you decided to actively take away a cuffed suspect from Security right in front of their faces, while using an adrenal implant during said chase? After that, what was your thought process and final goal while barricading yourself away from them? What was the end result you were seeking, both ICly and OOCly, when you kept avoiding stuns in that situation?

My thought process was similar to this:

"The HoS is not listening, he is taking my worker away despite my protests to be opened up on the surgery table. This isn't right, I can't just stand by and do nothing. I'll take him back to Science and then use the PA system to get the Captain's attention."

"I can't believe they are raiding science over this. I just PA'd the Captain. If I keep them out that will give him time to get here and sort this whole thing out."

"I have been tased in R&D and now the HoS is trying to cuff me. I'll activate my adrenal implant."

"The HoS stunprodded me and it activated my reactive teleport armor. I'll try one more time to shout at the capta- oh right the HoS has x-ray. I better run to the bridge, avoiding the main hallway in case I run into Beepsky or more Security."

"The HoS is firing lethals at me? Jesus christ. Okay he's wasted all his gun's energy and pulled out a telebaton. I'll just disarm him and take him to the Captain. If the captain won't pay attention I'll take the HoS directly to him. I'll risk going through the main hallway."

Edited March 31, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[FreeStylaLT]

What your thought process should have been:

"The HoS is not listening, he is taking my worker away despite my protests to be opened up on the surgery table. This isn't right, I can't just stand by and do nothing. I will contact the Captain directly through the Command channel that I have access to without directly interfering with Security, as I do not have the authority or the right to drag him away from an arrest as the head of Science department."

Of course, some leniency would be expected when it comes to interrupting arrests, which is why you dragging him away on its own was not as much of a problem as what followed.

"I can't believe they are raiding science over me kidnapping a possible EoC out of arrest right under Security's nose and having used an illegal implant in the process of it. I just PA'd the Captain. If I keep them out that will not make the situation any better for me, as they will be forced to take more measures to get to me, which they will, and cause more damage and chaos for Sec and me, while also give him [Captain] time to get here and sort this whole thing out by siding with the RD who has gone rogue with illegal equipment and who has begun kidnapping possible EoCs."

"I have been tased in R&D and now the HoS is trying to cuff me. I will not activate my adrenal implant as that may result in Sec resorting to Lethals as I become very apparently ineffective to subdue non-lethally. Instead, I should let HoS cuff me before I end up getting in administrative OOC trouble, as I have already caused too much chaos."

"The HoS stunprodded me and it activated my reactive teleport armor. I'll try one more time to shout at the capta- oh right the HoS has x-ray. I better surrender."

"The HoS is firing lethals at me? Jesus christ. I do not know what else I could have expected given that I am a person who cannot be subdued non-lethally due to both illegal (implants) and legal (armor) measures.  Okay he's wasted all his gun's energy and pulled out a telebaton. I'll surrender and be taken to the Captain. If the captain won't pay attention I'll take myself directly to him. I will go through the main hallway."

Do note, by the end the thought process should have been on OOC damage control, which would have revolved around mediating the conflict, turning yourself in, so on. This would make it easier on the IC situation, while also perhaps be taken into account when Administrators would have inevitably contacted you over the event.

Otherwise, I only see escalation on your end, with Sec following and reacting appropriately. You had a false assumption on what will be done to your subordinate, on which you acted and continued to escalate without ever considering how much IC and OOC chaos you were causing for Sec, along with what kind of assumptions they can make based on your actions, including using illegal implants multiple times to avoid arrest, on top of actively fleeing them.

It seems that you were not able to rationally asses your actions and the situation you were in on an OOC level. This is something we expect from every player, especially Heads. You should have ceased far sooner, but you failed to show an understanding that ceasing was at all an appropriate action.

I see no administrative fault here at all, Elysian had every right to punish you for such gross incompetence as a player, especially as a Head.

If you wish to dispute or have your ban lifted, Admin Complaints is not the correct place. You should be taking further discussion regarding your ban to the Ban Appeal section. Otherwise, the ban is fully legitimate and could have been harsher while still remaining appropriate. I strongly suggest against attempting to dispute a lighter-than-usual

Complaint considered resolved.

[Love-To-Hug]

12 minutes ago, FreeStylaLT said:

"The HoS is not listening, he is taking my worker away despite my protests to be opened up on the surgery table. This isn't right, I can't just stand by and do nothing. I will contact the Captain directly through the Command channel that I have access to without directly interfering with Security, as I do not have the authority or the right to drag him away from an arrest as the head of Science department."

I would like to know if you consider this an in-character issue or something that violates the server rules.

 

12 minutes ago, FreeStylaLT said:

"I can't believe they are raiding science over me kidnapping a possible EoC out of arrest right under Security's nose and having used an illegal implant in the process of it. I just PA'd the Captain. If I keep them out that will not make the situation any better for me, as they will be forced to take more measures to get to me, which they will, and cause more damage and chaos for Sec and me, while also give him [Captain] time to get here and sort this whole thing out by siding with the RD who has gone rogue with illegal equipment and who has begun kidnapping possible EoCs."

The Captain DID side with me when I told him the situation, so I'm not sure how my thought process was flawed in that respect.

 

12 minutes ago, FreeStylaLT said:

"I have been tased in R&D and now the HoS is trying to cuff me. I will not activate my adrenal implant as that may result in Sec resorting to Lethals as I become very apparently ineffective to subdue non-lethally. Instead, I should let HoS cuff me before I end up getting in administrative OOC trouble, as I have already caused too much chaos

Actually I would be very much against resorting to administrative action in either scenario because I believe this was an in-character dispute.

 

12 minutes ago, FreeStylaLT said:

Do note, by the end the thought process should have been on OOC damage control, which would have revolved around mediating the conflict, turning yourself in, so on. This would make it easier on the IC situation, while also perhaps be taken into account when Administrators would have inevitably contacted you over the event.

Why is this an OOC issue at all? That's what I can't understand. These are in-game events in which, in my mind, I was acting out my own personal perspective of events based on the knowledge I have. The server rules make exception for breaking your friends out of Security. That it is apparently flawed thinking to try and defy Security for something I feel unjust makes little sense to me in that context.

Edited March 31, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[Love-To-Hug]

To put this in simpler terms: Is actively trying to defy the Head of Security as a Head of Staff considered a violation of server rules?

If it isn't necessarily, then which actions crossed the line into rule violation territory?

Edited March 31, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[Monstrant]

 I find that it is justified for the Administration to punish you. To an extent that your actions DID draw a lot of security attention which IS  a rule break. It does not matter even if you were ICly correct, the fact that 20-30 minutes of precious Security time on a CULT round were wasted dealing with your situation. As RD i would do a similar thing to yours though I would use the bureacratic tools such as IAAs Magistrate or Captain as I should not be diverting time away. In my humble opinion the point about illegal implants is... a bit weak? I mean i am sure when admins play RD they too make and use these, to prevent such ICly situation happening it wouldnt hurt to just PDA Captain that you do have the implants, better Magistrate even (They are the law after all) The main issue I see here is miscommunication rather than a conflict whether the situation needed to handled icly or oocly. Love To Hug was not supposed to resist, rather actively trying to prove the innocence. I believe the ban is too heavy for what Love To has done for not only did she have a pure motive, she was not guilty after all, it was a misconception rather than deliberate rule breaking as such I do not see why such strict measures such as week ban were necessary.

TL;DR

Love its not that you DEFIED the HoS that mattered, its that you DISTRACTED the whole security during a very intense round which was wrong. However I do disagree with the harshness of the punishment.

Edited April 19, 2017 by Monstrant
grammar, clarification.

[Love-To-Hug]

On 4/19/2017 at 5:38 PM, Agent_Che said:

Love its not that you DEFIED the HoS that mattered, its that you DISTRACTED the whole security during a very intense round which was wrong.

I am not sure why a non-admin is replying to an admin complaint marked as resolved, but I very much disagree with this philosophy as it essentially holds the way Security reacts to actions to a higher importance than the severity of the actions themselves.

Under the same logic you could argue a clown with space lube is self-antagging if Security spends a lot of time chasing him rather than dealing with more pressing matters.

Edited April 21, 2017 by Love-To-Hug

[TullyBBurnalot]

Why is this not locked?

Filing.