[Re-Add Security Allowance to Ignore Self-Harm/Suicide.]

Frankly that sort of LRP behavior should be bwoinkable but what do I know 

[IPC upgrade system]

Alright everyone time to metagrudge vallidian and burn down his minecraft house 

[IPC upgrade system]

I'll bite, this is always a genuinely interesting debate to partake in :p

As a precursor, I would like to say that I don't view IPCs as useless, completely flimsy or helpless. They have some good bonuses. I just don't agree that they're super powerful like some would want others to believe. 

 

1 hour ago, Warriorstar said:

There are very few chemicals that are harmful to you, and you don't have to worry about being poisoned, or viruses. You're almost completely exempt from chem-memery

The chemicals that do have the ability to harm you, however, are the ones that are most devastating. Fire related chems, teslium, the sonic sound shit, chem grenades filled with the IPC 'buff' chems which can decimate if overdosed, etc. Couple that most of these aside from the last two incur brute or burn. 

1 hour ago, Warriorstar said:

You don't have to breathe, you don't need to keep emergency O2 on you, and you don't have to worry about the station filling with plasma or N2. Even being able to continue speaking in an airless breach is useful. 

IPCs are *completely exempt* from the effects of radiation. As an antag you can make life hell for the rest of the station with irradiation and not be affected. In addition, radstorms give you a station with every airlock open and the ability to roam around freely. 

Good points, nothing to add. These are the more powerful buffs of IPCs, and largely well balanced against their downsides. 

Edit: Well, okay, Shadey is definitely correct about radiation. I will say that being able to withstand a space breach for a longer time than a human can is still a fairly decent buff, especially coupled with tools. That said, it IS entirely pointless if you're also being attacked and exposed to space for longer than 30 seconds. You can't mend during a fight and you'll succumb to a combination of battle wounds and pressure damage quickly. In a vacuum when you're alone, however, there are merits to the ability. 

1 hour ago, Warriorstar said:

You don't need to eat, and borg chargers and APCs are (generally) everywhere

Power outages disable this. As for human hunger, you can often just fill a box with cheesy honkers and usually be fine throughout a round. Hunger seldom is an issue, more an annoyance, much as the entire SS13 community has tried to change this over the years. If a chef isn't around, players everywhere would drop dead without some sort of middle ground, and unfortunately that middle ground is capable of filling in entirely with very little issues. 

1 hour ago, Warriorstar said:

You can repair yourself with common household items. Like, think about what a big deal medicine is for organics, to the point where even wizards teleport to medical storage first. Different conditions require different chems, defibrillation might be necessary, or a sleeper, or you have to wait to get cloned, or maybe you're crashing from a meth overdose. As long as we have a welder and a length of cable (and aren't in crit) we're gucci

True, but being that it only takes a few hits to crit in most circumstances, and you generally have to sit still for various periods of time to heal... if someone wants you dead, you're dead very quickly. It only takes a few hits to incur a slowdown effect even without being put into crit. Limbs easily fly apart, which renders those repair tools useless in such a circumstance. EMPs, although no longer instant death, are still typically a round ender if someone is using it as a weapon against you. It isn't difficult to get one's hand on EMPs, either. 

Shadey's post also makes some good points regarding human healing. 

1 hour ago, Warriorstar said:

You can *continue to see and speak when debrained

Unless it was changed in my absence, IPC posibrains have their speakers set to 'off' by default. It's ultimately meaningless that they could technically speak if debrained since the speaker would have to be toggled back on. As Paradise also lacks any CMD related rules for humans, a recovered and revived human brain is perhaps only a few minutes of extra time away from revealing their killer in most circumstances compared to a recovered positronic. That's providing the brain is recovered in the first place, of course. The surgical procedure to remove a positronic is also much simpler than a human debraining procedure, being that it only requires engineering tools and a simple table.

1 hour ago, Warriorstar said:

I main miner, and the vast majority of the time I'm the only miner to survive most rounds to the end. I've also seen robust IPC wizards

Do you hunt megafauna like the other miners? Or do you just mine? What parts of an IPCs ability enable you to perform better than a human counterpart? What do you differ in playstyle from other human miners? I've played IPC miner, IPC blueshield and IPC security. Yes, you can still be efficient at those roles--but it takes considerable more effort, time and skill than an organic counterpart. As it should, too. Keep in mind that me and you also have considerable experience--the majority of IPC users do not share our playtime.

As for wizards, I don't doubt it. Wizards have a lot of mobility options, which is something an IPC player can make fantastic use of. Their buffs and downsides don't mean much if they don't get hit in the first place. 

 

This all said, the buffs IPCs do get which have meaning are still quite potent. Oxygen and rad immunity are quite useful. Viral immunity is useful. Welding damage immunity is useful. Adding further buffs to IPCs, even in the form of late game upgrades, would likely begin to encroach on an actual balance issue. As they are now, they are simple enough to dispatch by typical means, which encourages IPCs players to alter their playstyles and approach to most given situations. This, even indirectly, influences roleplay. It makes things feel more dynamic, rather than the same static encounters round after round. Taking that away would be a considerable mistake--especially to give them something so powerful as a speed buff. Mob speed is one of the most powerful tools in this game. If you can outrun any threat, you can run into that threat, cause serious damage and run away again before the other side can even react. 

 

Also hi shadey

[IPC upgrade system]

IPCs were always meant to be hardmode, and an RP race at heart. Paradise IPCs accomplish this well enough as is, so much so that other servers considering IPCs often look towards Paradise, rather than baycode synths. They fit Paradise and lower RP servers well, as a race that allows a player to easily introduce themselves to a different style of roleplay. 

 

These buffs have an interesting concept, but would take away much of the purpose behind IPCs. I will never agree that IPCs are 'too powerful', anyone that's actually tried to play them for awhile can tell you that isn't the case. But they don't need to be all that powerful--it's enough that they're diverse and encourage roleplay. If you want to play a more powerful, buff synth, there are lawed chassis.

[Make blueshield timelocked]

It's sensible for it to require command hours, as those are the individuals you will be tailing after much of the time. 

[Xenoflora, A way to give use to that elusive ????? trait in Strange Seeds]

As much as I'd love to have a xenobotany subsection again... science is already stupidly overpowered.

[Suggestion for a Karma Costing job that Focuses on Synthetics Repair]

When you take IPC as a race, you have to come to terms with their downsides. 

One of those is potentially being at the hands of a roboticist who isn't sure on how to fix you, or people bringing you to medical without thinking too much on it. 

I'd rather not streamline IPCs into medical. Roboticists, unless you're like me and enjoy RP in between work, already suffer from a lack of things to do during a round. I'd rather not take away one of their biggest responsibilities. 

[How do you play under different Synesthetic Lawsets?]

16 minutes ago, Daylight said:

You're either refusing to open the door, in which case you're breaking your laws and risk getting bwoinked, as there is nothing in the captain's room that would harm the clown, and the clown having additional access and/or the NAD without the codes does not cause anyone to come to physical harm (Advanced rules: Harm is assumed to mean physical harm. Stunning and flashing is not harm.)

Codes or not, you can apply enough common sense not to let the clown in to take the NAD--which is also a crime that, once committed, may easily escalate into harm depending on how both parties react. 

18 minutes ago, Daylight said:

You let the clown in, possibly stating over general comms that you are doing so (As I did when this scenario happened a few months back) and risk getting bwoinked for not using common sense to break your laws.

Again, it's not breaking the laws. 

AIs are not tools with which to grief/ greytide by proxy. I agree that crewsimov belongs in a trash can, but let's not misconstrue facts. 

[How do you play under different Synesthetic Lawsets?]

 

I feel like a lot of players just ignore crewsimov and act as normal people instead. If the clown asks you to open the captain's office (With spare ID and NAD inside) and noone immediately contradicts him, you are compelled to open the office, instead of delaying, asking for a second opinion or outright refusing him. In general, AIs and borgs should play around following their laws, instead of trying to defeat all evil and be the hero of the day.

I wasn't planning to talk much in this thread as I feel it's a fire waiting to happen, but this is probably the most egregious mindset that causes problems for AI players today. It's also a good show of why crewsimov is a very poor lawset. Crewsimov is an intentionally flawed lawset that we attempt to make solid and indisputable, which causes all nature of issues; and this isn't even getting into how horrible it is from a crew interaction perspective. "AI law 2 open door" is about as interesting to have spammed at you as it is to huff glue. 

AIs are assumed to be capable of intelligent, advanced thought. As well as with what Esenno said, it can be pretty damn obvious that the clown is only going to do harm with the captain's ID and nuke disk. Hell, I'd probably be more likely to bwoink an AI that randomly did something like this. 

More often than not, the people that say these things are the same people that get annoyed/ irate when they greytide and get smacked for it by security/ whoever. Put simply, if you're going to greytide, do not expect the entire server to bend to your will. 

[Wazaaaap]

What sound does the card make when you slice it in half?

[Wazaaaap]

what's the three numbers on the back of your card

[Round ID 28631 Comments, and feedback.]

It may behoove you to include the original fax in the complaint itself, so head admins aren't digging through as many logs. 

[A Nonsensical Lesson on Statistics]

Did the car drop any good loot

[Vamp rework balance/feature suggestions.]

16 hours ago, Woje said:

1. I don't think every vampire SHOULD reach full power. Full powered vampires on this rework are very powerful, and perhaps shouldn't even come up on every vampire round, let alone multiple of them.

I don't think the issue/ question is if they should be getting to full power every round--it's safe to say that they shouldn't expect that. The issue is what's encouraged and what players may feel they're expected to do to get to that point. I'm fairly certain your average player will feel the need to get to max power, and most will go to any extent they can to do so. This isn't unreasonable to think someone would do, yet it's the effects that come from this mindset that may be problematic. 

 

I'm overall neutral to this, but felt I should point this out. 

[Metagrudging and issues OOC - Open Letter]

Very much well said, and something that should have been more stressed during the community meeting.

[Game freezes after pressing TAB]

The wonders of Byond controller integration. I can use an N64 controller just fine, but lord forbid someone try a switch pro controller. 

[librarian design document]

I think if any overhaul happens to the librarian, we need to root through a good chunk of books (or hell, wipe them all [with warning so people can copy their own books first]) because currently there's a ton of dumb things like Naruto fanfictions. 

Onto the actual librarian, I also think that while an overhaul may be beneficial, forcing it onto players and characters isn't the way to go about it. IE forcing a character to have a 'late turn in' where their character may not even be interested in books in the first place is a bit jarring, for example. It should ideally not breach character agency. 

[AEG Rework Suggestion]

AEGs used to irradiate and incur a small stun. This was back in around 2014ish when radiation also spread to clothes and such, much like it does now (but much better coded). 

Perhaps something like this would be a good alternati--HEY PUT DOWN THE PITCHFORKS-

[Hi I'm Impedus and I'm gonna try and be more forum-active!]

6 hours ago, Melinda said:

when I was a kid I wanted to grow up and become a dinosaur.

this person has more ambitions than I did as a kid

[Expansion of genetic superpower: Ability to eat anything.]

This genetic power was notorious for being a greytiders best friend way back when, and it doesn't need any sort of love right now. 

Especially in regards to a device meant to end rounds. 

[Punkalope's Art Thread]

Time to admin delete all lattes

[Admin poll, uwu speak as an admin smite]

God no, please do not.

[Shit People on Discord Says]

Bruh, why are you like this 

[Add Action buttons to Space Pods]

I thought mech code itself was also bad tho

[Add Action buttons to Space Pods]

1 hour ago, Generaldonothing said:

Pods are really just weird mechs right now, I am in fully support of a total rework. 

I'm fairly sure they're actually subtypes of mechas in code, so you're dead on there.

One thing you CAN presently do is make custom keyboard macros using the macro system. This is the ONLY thing I have ever felt comfortable binding to a macro that's not an emote of some sort.

 

I do agree though, pods could use an overhaul.