johannhawk Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 alright, i have chatted with some people and necaladun in OOC if we could have different grades of traitor gear. its like this. syndie grade emag: infinite use can emag anything obviously syndicate gear comes at full price. street grade emag: not so infinite use cant emag high security objects its low tech enough to obtained by criminals,gangs,non-syndies,theifs,etc therefore you cant be charged with enemy of the corporation by security cheaper than the syndie grade emag --- syndie soap: fast cleanup has SYNDIE marked on it non-syndie soap: not as fast cleanup has S marked on it so you wont get permabrigged for having it i think you get what im aiming at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemanspark Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 This means you have to somehow make the streetgrade emags obtainable by the regular crew without being a traitor. Ehhhhhhhhh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qinetix Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 I think the point was that they might probably appear in other gamemodes too, if the gang wars mode will be implemented, but allowing them to be introduced to non-antags could lead to some ugly self antaging, not to mention promoting it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
necaladun Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Vox having them would be a good start. Adminboose is the other way. The real difference would be space law - they wouldn't be considered "enemy of NT" gear per se. I've had the same idea with pistols. Say have a 9mm and 10mm pistol, the 9mm slightly weaker, but not syndicate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarvinMartian34 Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 The thing is, if you have "non" syndicate traitor gear, we still all know that sec will still meta out the wazoo, and they'll still be charged with enemy of the corp for having gear that you can't get unless you are a traitor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox McCloud Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 The thing is, if you have "non" syndicate traitor gear, we still all know that sec will still meta out the wazoo, and they'll still be charged with enemy of the corp for having gear that you can't get unless you are a traitor. Pretty much this. If it's gear that only syndicate have access to, then officers are going to find SOME way to ding the person for a long long long time or even perma/execute them. Gear like emags being obtainable by regular crew? Nuu way. You'll see stuff like emagged borgs that are loyal to only one person, cargo literally bathing in syndicate gear---scientists roaming maintenance and the halls with stun guns and lethals and doctors stun-locking anyone suspected of sneezing the wrong way. Also worth pointing out: making syndicate gear available to the crew inevitably buffs non-traitor antags (with the exception of, say, Nuke Ops), as it not only allows them to have their antag-specific abilities, but ALSO access to traitor-gear as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johannhawk Posted May 8, 2015 Author Share Posted May 8, 2015 The thing is, if you have "non" syndicate traitor gear, we still all know that sec will still meta out the wazoo, and they'll still be charged with enemy of the corp for having gear that you can't get unless you are a traitor. Pretty much this. If it's gear that only syndicate have access to, then officers are going to find SOME way to ding the person for a long long long time or even perma/execute them. Gear like emags being obtainable by regular crew? Nuu way. You'll see stuff like emagged borgs that are loyal to only one person, cargo literally bathing in syndicate gear---scientists roaming maintenance and the halls with stun guns and lethals and doctors stun-locking anyone suspected of sneezing the wrong way. put some of it in a breifcases or safes on the derelict and other obscure places in the middle of space. AND you need to insert physical money to open them, like, alots of money. OR, plop down a very limited amount of street-grade smugglers satchels based on crew size that you need to insert money into to open and they spawn under a random floor tile. just throwing ideas that make T-ray scanners and money more useful in general. maybe even give people on the ''innaccurate suspect list'' clues in their IC mental notes of where the stashes are located, but that is kinda getting out of the scope of the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johannhawk Posted May 8, 2015 Author Share Posted May 8, 2015 The thing is, if you have "non" syndicate traitor gear, we still all know that sec will still meta out the wazoo, and they'll still be charged with enemy of the corp for having gear that you can't get unless you are a traitor. at least its going to be harder for them to pull that off to some degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidchan Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Yeah, I really don't want to see traitor gear being more common. Legitimate uses of a lot of traitor gear exists, and some traitor items are basically reskins of other items, but I've played on servers where it's possible for RnD to make Chameleon suits, for example, and it ALWAYS ends in the arrest/execution of said person by meta-happy sec. Sec would just start confiscating more stuff, declaring it contraband and brig otherwise innocent players for obscenely long times, and pretty damn good chance that the Warden or HoS gets a new toy to play with. Most of our sec players are hypocrites looking for any chance they can to assault and arrest crew, having illegal items more readily available is just another excuse for them to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
necaladun Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 What about being able to get say, a stun prod, or egun from an uplink? Stuff that would be on the station anyway, and thus can't be meta'd to be syndie? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemanspark Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 ...I've actually suggested we port the chameleon kits from baycode for RnD. It's funny as shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johannhawk Posted May 8, 2015 Author Share Posted May 8, 2015 [spoiler2]Yeah, I really don't want to see traitor gear being more common. Legitimate uses of a lot of traitor gear exists, and some traitor items are basically reskins of other items, but I've played on servers where it's possible for RnD to make Chameleon suits, for example,[/spoiler2] and it ALWAYS ends in the arrest/execution of said person by meta-happy sec. [spoiler2]Sec would just start confiscating more stuff, declaring it contraband and[/spoiler2] brig otherwise innocent players for obscenely long times, and pretty damn good chance that the Warden or HoS gets a new toy to play with. Most of our sec players are hypocrites looking for any chance they can to assault and arrest crew, having illegal items more readily available is just another excuse for them to do it. on the other side of the argument we could get the IAA to help security find out what your rights exactly are. or just share the gear with your fellow crewmembers to do something fun together and fight back somehow...disarms are great, IC buddies that got your back are better. at the very least we can find officers who want the gear for themselves faster and write complaints about them to the NT rep. a safer choice is to make protection implants ''protect'' you from street-grade contraband but that would take some coding, and its ALWAYS more complicated than you think. all in all it could improve player interaction and give civies a treasure hunt to do when they finally find clues or spawn with vague clues in their ''notes''. What about being able to get say, a stun prod, or egun from an uplink? Stuff that would be on the station anyway, and thus can't be meta'd to be syndie? im a slow typer and thinker and this showed up, i like that idea but i still would like the street-grade stuff to be rarely found by crew...its like excavating for artifacts but on the station and the ''artifacts'' are always somewhere under the floors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plotron Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 What about being able to get say, a stun prod, or egun from an uplink? Stuff that would be on the station anyway, and thus can't be meta'd to be syndie? THIS is slightly better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarvinMartian34 Posted May 10, 2015 Share Posted May 10, 2015 im a slow typer and thinker and this showed up, i like that idea but i still would like the street-grade stuff to be rarely found by crew...its like excavating for artifacts but on the station and the ''artifacts'' are always somewhere under the floors. Well, considering how hard it is to get just a useless artifact on the asteroid, these station "artifacts" better be EXTREMELY difficult to find. Like you have to beat the syndicate outpost that's filled with machine guns first to get a hint, and that shows you a hint on the derelict, and then go there to find the last hint, and then have to find the station again, and then the gun is hidden in a floor safe, protected by a turret with lethals or something, and then crack the safe. AND THEN you have to deal with shitcurity taking it for contraband and just taking your new toys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemanspark Posted May 10, 2015 Share Posted May 10, 2015 Or just tear apart the entire station until you find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johannhawk Posted May 10, 2015 Author Share Posted May 10, 2015 im a slow typer and thinker and this showed up, i like that idea but i still would like the street-grade stuff to be rarely found by crew...its like excavating for artifacts but on the station and the ''artifacts'' are always somewhere under the floors. Well, considering how hard it is to get just a useless artifact on the asteroid, these station "artifacts" better be EXTREMELY difficult to find. Like you have to beat the syndicate outpost that's filled with machine guns first to get a hint, and that shows you a hint on the derelict, and then go there to find the last hint, and then have to find the station again, and then the gun is hidden in a floor safe, protected by a turret with lethals or something, and then crack the safe. AND THEN you have to deal with shitcurity taking it for contraband and just taking your new toys. what about giving the people on the ''cent. com. status summary'' a clue in their notes that hints at ONE of the stashes, and they can hunt the floortiles that hides the stashes themselves or just give the info to the bartender or some civie. it would make reliable sources TM be reliable for something and give security something to aim at incase its a extended round or they have nothing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarvinMartian34 Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 im a slow typer and thinker and this showed up, i like that idea but i still would like the street-grade stuff to be rarely found by crew...its like excavating for artifacts but on the station and the ''artifacts'' are always somewhere under the floors. Well, considering how hard it is to get just a useless artifact on the asteroid, these station "artifacts" better be EXTREMELY difficult to find. Like you have to beat the syndicate outpost that's filled with machine guns first to get a hint, and that shows you a hint on the derelict, and then go there to find the last hint, and then have to find the station again, and then the gun is hidden in a floor safe, protected by a turret with lethals or something, and then crack the safe. AND THEN you have to deal with shitcurity taking it for contraband and just taking your new toys. what about giving the people on the ''cent. com. status summary'' a clue in their notes that hints at ONE of the stashes, and they can hunt the floortiles that hides the stashes themselves or just give the info to the bartender or some civie. it would make reliable sources TM be reliable for something and give security something to aim at incase its a extended round or they have nothing to do. Well, how about they get a hint to go to the outpost, and then the outpost gives a hint to the derelict, which hints to the station, which is protected by a turret? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johannhawk Posted May 11, 2015 Author Share Posted May 11, 2015 then you would only need to find a out of spot turret on the station... so we could just make the hidden stash have 34% chance to have street grade traitor stuff and 66% chance to have very useful stuff every assistant dreams of (insulated gloves, toolbelts, multitools) , to make it more rare but still possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarvinMartian34 Posted May 11, 2015 Share Posted May 11, 2015 Well I still wanted it hidden behind a wall that you had to deconstruct or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johannhawk Posted May 11, 2015 Author Share Posted May 11, 2015 Well I still wanted it hidden behind a wall that you had to deconstruct or something. then a powergamer every shift will break down that wall once every shift they figure out all the spawn locations. unless its under a floor in a random spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johannhawk Posted August 2, 2015 Author Share Posted August 2, 2015 ...bump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
improvedname Posted August 2, 2015 Share Posted August 2, 2015 Put iT in Spess make a Tiny syndiecate outpost Being protected by 1 Unarmed syndiecate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johannhawk Posted March 9, 2016 Author Share Posted March 9, 2016 ok, i need to rewrite alot of this, and my intents. i want people to think twice before validhunting that guy with gear, especially when we now have a rule against it. i want to make use of that roundstart reliablesourcesTM (doesnt exist as of now, no idea where it went) paper that tells captain and HoS who could be a antag, (and its always wrong and even lists the HoS sometimes) and if antags DO get listed on it, they get a minor boost. i want to change that so every person that gets listed on it will get hints on gear locations, and it will also make security asking them NICELY where it is before somebody else that has a hint gets it before sec does, useful for empty extended rounds. i want to keep this random, so people wont powergame the same spots constantly, even if it has a turret defending it. i prefer it would be in a smuggler satchels under some floors, and possibly having said smuggler satchel just having a another hint to a another satchel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldflame Posted March 9, 2016 Share Posted March 9, 2016 Reliable sources got axed because there was no way to use the information. More on-topic: I really don't see how it's validhunting to make the connection between having antag items and being an antag. They fucked up, they got caught and prosecuted. Intentionally giving traitors a smokescreen of plausible deniability that can't be broken will make it next-to-impossible to actually nail a 404 charge on any traitor who makes a remote effort to hide their tracks when commiting crimes. Antags have it pretty rough on para, but intentionally crippling sec's ability to do their job won't fix it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johannhawk Posted March 9, 2016 Author Share Posted March 9, 2016 Reliable sources got axed because there was no way to use the information. More on-topic: I really don't see how it's validhunting to make the connection between having antag items and being an antag. They fucked up, they got caught and prosecuted. Intentionally giving traitors a smokescreen of plausible deniability that can't be broken will make it next-to-impossible to actually nail a 404 charge on any traitor who makes a remote effort to hide their tracks when commiting crimes. Antags have it pretty rough on para, but intentionally crippling sec's ability to do their job won't fix it. well, you know, whats stopping sec from confiscating gear as soon as possible and brigging 20 minutes for that? antag or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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