whiskeyfur
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Posts posted by whiskeyfur
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Just now, ZN23X said:
I literally never harmbaton unless I have the intent to kill. Justifiably. Meaning against KOS antags and I'm out of ammo. I literally so not get the point of harmbatoning otherwise unless you are just a dick.
It was a bit of an exaggeration to say they'll go straight to harmbaton. I was aiming more towards the fact I try not to even bring legal action into the minor incidents if it can be solved on the spot. Stun baton for everything? no. Someone having minor contraband? If that was the worst they did I'll note they had it, warn them and take the contraband for disposal. No reason to go the full monty on them. (Lowsec) trespassing? If they needed something I'll escort them into the area and look for someone who DOES work there and see if they're willing to help.
I did joke with a guy about having a syndie soap bar... asked if he thought that would make him look like a bad boy to the ladies. Was it contraband? No.
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The biggest thing I remember from my first round was the fact it was an extended round, that it was actually fun RPing just as a civie and learning the way things are, my first cloning after getting stupid with the air tanks... low stress, lots of time to learn the (IC) rules and systems in place...
At the end of the round, imagine my disappointment when I'm told the truth about how chaotic it gets with traitors, vampires, wizards, changelings, shadowlings, cultists... and that an extended round is not likely to happen again.
Next round, 10 minutes into the game I get kidnapped by a vampire and eaten, then cremated.
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May not have been in security.. but as captain, I believe that qualifies in the sense what they do is still my responsibility.
I don't remember the exact details any more but as captain I had a HoS literally go rogue, throw insults over comms to the point even the NT rep came down on him in common... basically.. the epitome of shitcurity. It was bad enough Wolf who was NT rep recommended his removal.
Finally I had enough one more incident and 2 previous warnings, told him to come to the bridge. He didn't take demotion too well and went rogue. It took security and Alice (our blueshield that round) to finally bring him in. The problem? His warden came in, refused to accept this, and also tried to start a fight. Alice robusted both of those bastards, in full riot gear without even breaking a sweat. AND NEITHER OF THEM WERE ANTAGS.
Soon enough we had replacement warden and HoS but that experience basically told me even as captain, I can't always trust security... and that's a bad position to be in.
This incident is one of those reasons I'll take the captain slot as a last resort or if I'm really in a mood to abuse myself...
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Every time I've played security I've tried to work it out on the spot without the need for brigging anyone, and even took a few to see the psychiatrist. That doesn't mean I hadn't hit the clown a few times to get his attention though.... I swear people only play clowns so they can grief.
I will say, not all security reach for the harmbaton as a solution to everything.
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I would like to see that instead of disabled, their access is logged and reported. That way, you need to track someone's movements? Set the id on watched, even link it into their arrest state of watched+.
To be a sneaky captain/hos, set a suspected cultist to watched and track him back to his friends...
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25 minutes ago, Spacemanspark said:
Isn't this what cryo is for?
I'm rather unsure as to what you want here.
And why would NT want to waste the resources to cryo a non-worker when they can be shipped off to earth instead? Cryo implies they're still an asset to the station... the shuttle is the final GTFO (that round).
If it's at the character's option, that's one thing.. but if it's because of a medical/mental issue? that's different. It can also be a chance to pull a Weyland-Yutani and try to get someone who has a xeno egg in them off to corporate HQ...
It can also be the end result of a short prison term too... 15 minutes in the brig. Still don't want to work? Shipped out. The 15 minutes is to give them time to think about it.
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A Shuttle Back to CENTCOM
I would like to suggest a shuttle that sends the people back to centcom for reassignment or discharge back to earth.
Reasons it can be used:
- It gives an IC way to quit your character without leaving them SSD all over the place...
- Permabrig prisoners can be shipped off... the permabrig on station becomes a temporary holding area for those prisoners
- Mentally unstable individuals can be sent back for more specialized care
- It can also be a way for characters to quit in protest in response to comdom's and other bad chiefs.
- Don't like your boss? HoP not giving you a job change? or don't want a different job? Leave. Come back next shift.
The end result is the CHARACTER is out of commission for that round, but the PLAYER is allowed to continue, perhaps to be a golem, maintenance bot or ERT members should the opportunity arise.
NT's view: If you aren't going to be an asset, you are a liability. A few minutes in the brig is fine.. but someone who proves time and again that they are not an asset, there's no reason to keep them. And if they're driving people away... that's even worse. Put them on a shuttle and send them back to centcom. If they're not willing to work, send'em home to earth (or wherever). Those unable to work (PTSD?) can go back for specialized care.
And if CENTCOM gets too many people leaving 'cause the captain is being one of those... the admins can drop the hammer on the captain then even on rounds with no NT or IAC rep.
OOCly, The player becomes a ghost and could continue his round, but his character is done.
The cryo bay can be set to not automatically delete people then, just leave them in the tubes if they intend to come back that round. If they intend to leave completely, they can go onto the shuttle, or just stay in the departure's lounge and go SSD, someone could then push them onto the shuttle.
One of the reasons I'm suggesting this is I measured how much time I wasted as a doctor on people who were SSD... something like 1 out of 4 patients. There's no reason for that other than network issues. Plus all of those SSD who are still on station when the emergency shuttle leaves? That's a bummer for a doctor who takes his oath to do no harm seriously.
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I think a combination of alerts would have to be doable... it's quite possible to have a medical and an engineering incident... so the alert system might have a problem because setting medical and THEN setting engineering, one will override the other.
Probably the best interim solution is to give the captain more discretionary power. If there's an emergency condition, he can outline in a broadcast to everyone which SOP laws are getting modified for the duration of the alert.
Medical and engineering? He suspends the laws on weapons for medical personal only (and only for the syringe gun), and also tells everyone that engineers are to be given full access.
Violating THAT is a separate charge in itself like someone who refuses to get their shots or a scientist who keeps engineers out of his workplace, both would be facing brig time and potential demotion/firing. -
Bottom line for me is this: Too many people think it's 'fun' to grief security and ignore what they say when the real problems happen. And this breaks immersion for those who really want to get serious about it.
The usual response? "It's just a game..."
Well, sorry. Common sense here... if you see a bunch of cops surrounding a building in a standoff, guns drawn... do you walk up to those cops and start messing with them?
No. And anyone who says yes to this needs their head checked... sadly it seems in game, the standing answer is yes. This is not acceptable. -
I guess one way to mitigate the whole access level is a compromise. In order to produce AI boards, the RD has to swipe his card into the terminal before it'll let the operator make those boards. Otherwise, they're locked out.
Could do the same for a number of other items too, and illegal? Emag or RD again -
7 hours ago, willior13 said:
For this to work as you intend, you should groom the xenos into a nasty pest that really threatens the station's survival, and the ERT should arrive five minutes after they do for them to interact in the way that you want them to.
Actually I was pretty clear I wanted the ERT to show up AFTER the xenos were either dealt with or truly out of control (and that requires the wizards to be failing at their job too). The ERT should be seen as a potential antagonist in this case, depending on what the captain decides.
Hell, it's quite possible the wizards beat feet after the captain owing them one, and the ERT get there after they're long gone so there's no evidence they were around. This is a scenario that can run any number of ways. -
I would like to see a dispatcher type position too set up in securit and actually used, where someone is set up to use the cameras and crew monitor to see where and how everyone is, and can call security to any potential issues that come up. It's an easy job in that they don't have to interface with people, and it's very, very useful to security. Similar idea to someone in atmos actually watching the air monitors and checking for alarms. Or medical and monitoring crew health. I'm surprised these stations are not manned more often. They are critical to stopping most antags and issues before they start or compound into situations beyond any recovery
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5 hours ago, Purpose2 said:
@whiskeyfur Thats a playerbase issue though
And they're trying to solve it with code... sorry, as someone who came from the age of dial-in BBS's and door games, all through MUX's and MUSH's and into our current crop of games, minecraft admin and alll... sorry, you can not fix player behavior with code. The BEST that can be done is to whitelist every antag position, with whitelisting meaning the admins have vetted that player as being responsible enough to know he is not playing for himself and can make the rounds interesting for all.
The only way to fix this is to crack down on the players themselves with admin setting the standard on what game requires. Applying code blindly, is like applying a bandaid to fix a broken leg.. on the arm. It just doesn't work.
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Based on what I've seen.. sadly I would have to disagree with you Purpose2. People are going wide with their objectives for one reason only most times.. because they can.
An antag is suppose to make it fun for everyone by providing a challenge, not allow that one or two players who ONLY plays antags their private fun at expense of everyone and can't take losing. I have seen more shades of this kind of player as an antag than any other of late.
I'm not going to name names (although I presume people already have their suspicions), but these are the kind of players who don't play any roles, stay as civilian and think nothing of breaking into places.. and when the opportunity for a conversion antag comes up, they take it. Their fun is only in doing what they want, not making it fun for folks, and at least once I saw someone who was caught just SSD instead of getting taken to the brig.
I have no respect for those antags. None at all, and this proposals do not address that at all. What needs to happen is for those problem players to be shown the door out because they are playing antags for their own fun, no one else's.
For note, I have played as an antag, and yes while I was bad at it, I had put my own fun second to everyone else's. That is why I think people should be an antag and if they are incapable of putting themselves second to the entire server? They don't need to be antags, period.
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18 hours ago, EldritchSigma said:
I saw in the 3 rounds I spectated today following: An Engineer brought the Autolathe board to science within the first 5 minutes of the shift... I am crying on the inside. Because of joy.
On another note: Again if you want to crack down on powergamers just dont. They will always find away. Heck they probably move to botany next because its the newest most powergamey department right after science if you know how to do it. And if other departments are not cooperational you are not cooperational aswell and dont do ANYTHING at all but scichem or other shit. Simple as that. Why bothering with half things if you can do the full deed which you cant because the most unrelieable factor got added into science which is other people NOT working in science. Still you can kill a target even without science equipment and make them dissappear without a trace. You dont need science for that... all it needs is a stunprod, a pair of cuffs and some form of EMP or mute. Meth might help but its not required. Literally... you cannot stop those most efficient tactics aviable (or meta). There will always be one. And a good fraction of people will always use that, no matter what.
I don't see this pull as fixing anything for the reasons EldritchSigma named. Because of this pull, with science already difficult enough for a new guy to it (me), now? I'm going back to medical, and brushing up on my skills so I don't have to rely on them because I don't think they'll pull through and update the machines in a timely manner anymore.
In trying to stop powergaming this pull in fact punished.. everyone perhaps? Except the power gamers.-
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I enjoy cult rounds for one reason and one reason only really.. they ALLOW for normal RP to happen for a longer period then other game modes do. And when the big event at the end happens and Nar'sie comes out? Well, end of the round anyways. time to go. It's no different to me than that of the shuttle coming to take everyone off of station
I think we should look at other game modes as having something wrong here. Syndicate? they see someone who isn't security in the hallway? They shoot/bomb/tase/kill them. Wizards? Boom on sight. They're problem is people who play antags are indiscriminate about who they kill. Cultists are not indiscriminate. They should be an example of the norm, not the exception. And really? Players who play indiscriminant antags should not be playing antags.
A doctor who is trying to save someone who isn't a target, is NOT A THREAT! Yet he's treated like one... every time. It's like someone attacking the red cross on the battlefield... that's not just a no but a hell no and that gets people strung up for war crimes.
Really.. we have too many final solutions (NUKE NUKE NUKE) and not enough 'capture the station' goals. If I was a doctor and I hard the Syndicate took over the station, captain and most heads dead? As a doctor I would go, "well.. shit. So, whose left that needs help?"
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I'm thinking the key milestone here is that the ERT arrives after the Xenos are wiped out, not before.. so the only threats ERT has to deal with is the Wizards, and potentially a divided crew of the station.
Unless of course the xenos are really that far out of control...
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I would suggest tht if the sign is up, then just walking into the door will not open it. You have to turn the sign off, which would have the button to enable and close it on both sides.
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3 hours ago, Enginseer-42 said:
Mutadone is on the wiki as well.
As a complete tangent to this. It seems to me that it would be cool if heads of staff could implement alternative operating procedure. Cook something up for your department. Submit a copy to IAA so they can Know what to look for. Get the captain to sign off and bam.
Would be interesting.
My view from the captain's chair... if it makes things more efficient, let me know and we'll come to an agreement.
Just be prepared to defend it 'cause I will try to poke holes in your proposal, including safety concerns.
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Glowshrooms and light panels really are the only way to control their growth, as even security, no matter how robust they are, can't catch a shadowling who decides to bail and go somewhere else.
These light panels and glowshrooms are a /necessity/ to control their movement. Removing glowshrooms will give these shadowlings not just a 90% chance of victory but 99/100 I feel.
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Just now, CPTCoffee said:
What's your IC name? Just Makka?
The full name is makkau... something.. something. Black vulp. It started as a random name and I liked it enough to keep it. I was also "the silent one" when I did the mime thing one round. If I wasn't at work I would log in and put it here.
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This is Makka here... (aka Makkukauchauch Yaghzth, what a muzzleful)
I've noticed a subtle change in how I've been playing (former) Dr. Makka since picking up and attempting captain, and twice now I've had rounds exceed 2 hours but no complaints.
Some of the more notable events in those times:
- I've had to replace a misbehaving warden and HoS, once. Both were fired at gunpoint practically.
- One time we had cultists, and they were managed.. barely (Xenos arriving kinda ruined that success)
- A vampire got me right in the office (no longer will I hide in there... I learned that lesson the hard way)
- Both times we got our objectives completed. A DNA vault and a BSA.. (despite a few dropped messages here and there, still got done.. late, but done)
- Had a bit of drama with the CE pleading for the life of his syndicate GF... results: permabrig instead of execution.
- Blindsided the NT rep a couple times. I believe wolf was surprised when it was mentioned there were cultists on board... cultists? Or was it something else... either way he wasn't aware of /that/ problem. Or the other one. We had a triple whammy that round.
- Ms. Muse redecorated the bridge once, loved it.
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Almost killed off by the syndicate at the end of round two in a well planned ambush. (nicely done, whoever the antag was there).
- Still survived by the skin of the teeth. I was a little disappointed though that I wasn't the target.. I couldn't thumb my nose at the antag then. Ah well.
- Many. MANY kudos to Alice as the blueshield. Any captain that has her as their blueshield should feel honored and privileged.
I have noticed this: That Makka has been less easy going as time progresses and while content to let the heads do their thing.. he's also watching for violations and isn't as shy about calling them on it. A word of warning once in a while tends to get the message across and little more needs be said, except in one case.
I do recognize that the captain's role on station is to ensure some kind of stability to set the scene so to speak for everyone, so really my fun is secondary to everyone else's. (Doesn't mean I can't have fun in the process though and it has been.)
What I'm asking the player base, for those who had to interact with me on those occasions.. Am I doing well, and what can I improve?
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Please. please don't bring this back, ever. Greytiding is a right pain in the ass at it's /best/ and at it's worst... I'll just go SSD. It's not worth playing to me.
edit: Wow, timing.. spacespark responded seconds before I did as I was writing this...
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I had a rather unusual situation today as the captain.
Syndicate agent was caught bombing people and wanted to die. Her boyfriend pleads with me to reduce it from execution so I cut him a deal. Give me /something/ and I'll drop it to permabrig. He comes back with.. very little. But, I liked the CE and he does damned good work, so in exchange for saving her, he puts his department into overdrive and it was greatly needed at the time.
Then she tried to commit suicide. Now I have a chief engineer working his tail off in exchange for keeping his GF alive, who is now in a sleeper with enough ether to keep her out.
Then a shitcurity officer declares on security channel he's going to execute her and not only did I jump his case, the magistrate did as well.
I'll say it was an interesting shift.
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Psychiatrist's Notes - Jack Edwardson
in Stories of NSS Cyberiad
Posted
In my mind that puts them into the category of the deranged and insane then and deserve psychiatric care, not more beatings... unless that's what it takes to keep them controlled and safe.