monkeysfist101 Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 In honor of Alice's departure, I propose a drink be added to the menu. The Peirson: 1 part Whiskey, 1 part lime, 1 part blood. Greytide tested, Arthur_Dayne approved. And I guess I'd be willing to sprite the drink... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur_Dayne Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 (edited) ... Edited April 10, 2015 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarvinMartian34 Posted March 17, 2015 Share Posted March 17, 2015 In honor of Alice's departure, I propose a drink be added to the menu.The Peirson: 1 part Whiskey, 1 part lime, 1 part blood. Greytide tested, Arthur_Dayne approved. And I guess I'd be willing to sprite the drink... GONNA GET DRUNK AS F*** MOURNING THE LOSS OF HER ON THIS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeysfist101 Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 Anyway, here's Wonderw- I mean my work in progress. http://puu.sh/gEL5j/b64d325265.png Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox McCloud Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Nope. Sorry, we're not making snowflake references like this; it's been our policy for quite a while now and was pretty much fully instituted when we axed all the admin offices on centcomm. If you want your ego stroked, you'll have to get it done elsewhere other than the codebase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemanspark Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 If you want your ego stroked, you'll have to get it done elsewhere other than the codebase. Well that doesn't sound rude or anything. I honestly don't see an issue with a drink being made. It's not like it's some special NanoTrasen office... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur_Dayne Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Tbh, I think Monkey made this more as a joke thing. I didn't have anything to do with it, so don't go ahead and call me out on my "ego". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadPojo Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Tbh, I think Monkey made this more as a joke thing. I didn't have anything to do with it, so don't go ahead and call me out on my "ego". Thanks obama. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeysfist101 Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 For starters, I was serious. Alice has been an integral part of Paradise for a very long time and has build somewhat of a folk hero status. What's wrong with adding a drink to commemorate one of the characters that most of the players know? Characters who's players have never even heard of Paradise Station like George Melons and Cuban Pete have items named after them, so why not one of our own. I can't imagine how this would effect anyone's "ego" due to it being suggested by multiple people in game. (I'm just the guy who posted it) We're not asking for a map change or an event, just a bit of fun referencing everyone's favorite Blueshield. You can go after Arthur if you want, Fox, but the only person who looks bad here is you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox McCloud Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 For starters, I was serious. Alice has been an integral part of Paradise for a very long time and has build somewhat of a folk hero status. What's wrong with adding a drink to commemorate one of the characters that most of the players know? Characters who's players have never even heard of Paradise Station like George Melons and Cuban Pete have items named after them, so why not one of our own. I can't imagine how this would effect anyone's "ego" due to it being suggested by multiple people in game. (I'm just the guy who posted it) We're not asking for a map change or an event, just a bit of fun referencing everyone's favorite Blueshield. You can go after Arthur if you want, Fox, but the only person who looks bad here is you. No more integral than Zeke Northey, Jager Kunstig, Jasper Donnelly, Kahjitt Nazkiin, or any other number of extremely influential player characters on Paradise, but I'd venture to guess those names don't mean much in this day and age (no offense to any of them at all)--why? Inactivity, shifting times, and shifts in playersbase. A player, admin, or anyone should be remembered for who they were and what they did/stood for and not because the codebase has snowflake reference to them (positive or negative). Yes, there's reference to George Melons (bad) and Cuban Pete--had these been more modern figures to have arisen to prominence they would NOT have been included in the codebase either. This isn't singling out Arthur; this is policy for everyone; player and admin alike--snowflake in-game reference to players and player characters is a no-go; that's for interaction amongst members of the community itself, not the codebase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemanspark Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 The thing is, though: 1. It only shows the last name (Not even the number.). 2. It's a fucking drink. 3. This... doesn't effect gameplay at all. I mean, I could see if there was a special gun or something named 'The Alice Pierson Badass' that one shots everything. But... again, it's a drink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox McCloud Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 The thing is, though:1. It only shows the last name (Not even the number.). 2. It's a fucking drink. 3. This... doesn't effect gameplay at all. I mean, I could see if there was a special gun or something named 'The Alice Pierson Badass' that one shots everything. But... again, it's a drink. And neither did a lot of the previous references, but it's still snowflake aggrandizement and ego-stroking to some degree, no matter who it's for. It's not generally a culture or behavior we want to encourage and it's certainly not something that has place in a codebase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belarion Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) First we have special drinks, next there will be a statue... And before you know it, we're the Peirsonist People's Alicepublic of Cyberaid. Edited March 18, 2015 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemanspark Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Considering it's such a small thing, and, from what I can tell, multiple players want it, it doesn't sound like a huge issue. It's not even that snowflakey, it's just another drink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox McCloud Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Considering it's such a small thing, and, from what I can tell, multiple players want it, it doesn't sound like a huge issue.It's not even that snowflakey, it's just another drink. You're missing the point; it's creating a drink specifically for the purpose of mentioning a player; that's snowflake no matter how you cut it. It doesn't matter if it's just a drink or a piece of paper; references like this just have no place on Paradise's codebase. The same could be said for any of us; I could easily code in "Fox/Novus/Makota's Energy Gun"; give it a unique sprite and put it in a crate in cargo--same stats as an energy gun, same price, same amount--it's literally identical; it's not increasing the power level of the game, it's not overpowered or anything, but it IS engaging in aggrandizement of that player character and referencing them (not to mention stroking their egos). Again, I can't stress enough; it doesn't matter who it is, what they've done, or how big/small of a reference it is; this simply does not have a place on the codebase itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belarion Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) In all seriousness though, I think the importance of certain players in game is very much overstated. They're good players, pretty decent at immursion too, and errybody loves them in OOC. And that's great, but their impact on the community as a whole isn't that big. Folks like Cuban Pete are mythical for doing things crashing the server with a game mechanic, Alice types are around all the time. I've only been playing SS13 for a year, and on this server alone I can name a half dozen young, female authority figures, with authority issues, who have an extensive backstory and classified security records, with plenty snowflakey (not necessarily in a bad way ) stuff thrown in, who've played for a while, made a bit of impact, gotten known, then promptly faded into the ether for whatever reason. Memetic characters like Alice are fun to have around, but they're not legends, really grinds my gears when the hero worship stage sets in :twisted:, Not in game either, OOC you get declarations of actual IRL love. Its just weird. Edited March 18, 2015 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earthdivine Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 To be perfectly honest, like fox said there's a lot of people who don't get mentioned at all that defined paradise as it is today. Altair defined who the NT Reps were and gave us the idea of the job, Squish Larkens set the bar for slimes everywhere, Dave gave us the idea of Vox who weren't thieves and could be considered equals, but they don't get mentioned at all. Not to mention for a drink name it's...kinda uninspiring. Alice already lives on in another way, in showing how to be an officer of NT, and I'm more then certain when people see ALICE they will think of her rather then the movie or novel rip off ALICE originally was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeysfist101 Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 it's still snowflake aggrandizement and ego-stroking to some degree, no matter who it's for. It's not generally a culture or behavior we want to encourage Similar to taking a tajaran, claiming it's another race, and breaking Rule 9 in the process? Also, in the same vein, you're misusing special snowflake. What is happening here isn't Special Snowflake Syndrome. By definition, a special snowflake is "A member of that newly-adult, me'er-than-me generation which expects attention and praise just for being themselves -- doing anything to deserve it is completely optional." Arthur had no part in the drink idea other than agreeing with the ingredients. This is, in fact, the opposite of Special Snowflake Syndrome. This is OTHER people suggesting a tribute based on merit and popularity. Source: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.p ... +snowflake EDIT: Replies are coming in faster than I'm writing, so bear with me. 1. I really can't speak for members passed that didn't have things put in, mainly because they were either already gone or on their way out by the time I joined. 2. Earth, the name is just a placeholder given in the spur of the moment. 3. Belarion, Cuban Pete may be mythical, but when's the last time Morninglow's been on ANY server? He may be legendary, but he's from another server and is famous for exploiting a mechanic that Paradise does not use. 4. If the reason for not wanting Alice to have a homage is because previous members didn't get one, I'll gladly look up their characters and sprite one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox McCloud Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 it's still snowflake aggrandizement and ego-stroking to some degree, no matter who it's for. It's not generally a culture or behavior we want to encourage Similar to taking a tajaran, claiming it's another race, and breaking Rule 9 in the process? First off, not the topic on hand, second of, let's not resort to personal attacks, now shall we? Likewise, I never once mentioned players being snowflake--I said: Nope. Sorry, we're not making snowflake references like this Bolded by me for emphasis. Hardly making accusations of a snowflake character. Also, in the same vein, you're misusing special snowflake. What is happening here isn't Special Snowflake Syndrome. By definition, a special snowflake is "A member of that newly-adult, me'er-than-me generation which expects attention and praise just for being themselves -- doing anything to deserve it is completely optional." Arthur had no part in the drink idea other than agreeing with the ingredients. This is, in fact, the opposite of Special Snowflake Syndrome. This is OTHER people suggesting a tribute based on merit and popularity. Source: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.p ... +snowflake The inclusion of the drink itself referencing the player is snowflake---again I said nothing about the player character themselves; I never called the character a snowflake, contrary to your assertion. Coding a dozen lines of code purely to reference a character is snowflake reference--no way around that. 4. If the reason for not wanting Alice to have a homage is because previous members didn't get one, I'll gladly look up their characters and sprite one. Again, that's not the issue; you're missing the point entirely; we don't need more snowflake reference to justify this snowflake reference; snowflake references are just plain na-da & no-go; they have zero place in Paradise's codebase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belarion Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 (edited) 3. Belarion, Cuban Pete may be mythical, but when's the last time Morninglow's been on ANY server? He may be legendary, but he's from another server and is famous for exploiting a mechanic that Paradise does not use. 4. If the reason for not wanting Alice to have a homage is because previous members didn't get one, I'll gladly look up their characters and sprite one. The thing with myths, is they're immaterial.. wouldn't be a myth if he was stood at the front door would he? Let me put it like this, I don't think there should be anything named after somebody unless they're God level, even then, probably not, its a bad precedent Not because its not deserved, but because IMO its the equivalent of renaming mt Everest after your dinnerlady. Edited March 18, 2015 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IcyV Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Throwing in my old two cents for what little it matters. Special snowflakes are bad. Adding things to the code for people is bad. No matter how little it is, it's bad. It encourages favoritism, sloppy additions, and adds nothing to the overall experience other than a "huehue my name is in the game". Just because things *have* been added in the past doesn't mean it was good or should continue to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeStylaLT Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 As minor and insignificant it may seem, it is still a long-term addition for someone who has made a short-term, minimal real impact to the server. If this were to be added, in a month, or a few months, or even a week, once the playerbase shifts and new people have become acclimatized with the server people will be asking the question: "Who the hell's a Peirson?" as they drink it. The bartender will shrug "I dunno just some stupid name, misspelled "Person" probably.", seeing how Alice never has and never will, now that she's "gone", reach a community-wide legend status of Cuban Pete, who is still hard enough to find reliable information about without word-of-mouth, leaving the drink completely useless and nonsensical to everyone who isn't around now. If you really want something like this added, I suggest donating and asking for it to be your fluff item, at least then it would blur into obscurity and die with you, not the server or it's codebase, where the "big deal" of now should not be left ingrained in the codebase pretty much permanently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
necaladun Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Throwing in my old two cents for what little it matters. Special snowflakes are bad. Adding things to the code for people is bad. No matter how little it is, it's bad. It encourages favoritism, sloppy additions, and adds nothing to the overall experience other than a "huehue my name is in the game". Just because things *have* been added in the past doesn't mean it was good or should continue to happen. Very much this! I was behind the (stupid!) decision to put offices in Centcomm. This lead to more requests for people to have their own. Snowflake references snowball. Once a few are added, people request more, and if we don't add them, it causes problems. If I add something for one person, I'd feel bad about not adding it for other people - bad towards their characters who also deserve the recognition, but also towards the players who I feel I'm doing a disservice too. The other issue here is downstream servers who use our code having a bunch of references, like we did with Creed's office. This is nothing personal against Alice or any other characters - it's just something we decided as an admin team that it's a door we don't want to go down, and closed it shortly after I stupidly opened it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saaesculus Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I will 100% support this if it makes you fart every cycle That is the only condition on which I will support this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemanspark Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I will 100% support this if it makes you fart every cycle That is the only condition on which I will support this We need a drink like that. Ahahaha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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